The New Wedding Guest

I will make sure to put a slip in my invites that say no picture taking by the isles or in veiw of the photographer

Stuff like this is always a fun read, and I like your perspective, making suggestions like suggesting your to your bride to encourage no picture taking during ceremony is a proactive approach. As you know we’ve always had to battle against stuff like this, each year it gets harder and harder to not get totally deflated by the obstacles.

That said, as professionals we’ve always had to be savvy in ways to make us stand out from the rest. Now more than ever is the time to prove that. :)

We would LOVE that.

GREAT post!

When I look at these images my heart sinks. I have taken many of these images and it is sad. great post.

Thank you for this.

I agree. But that’s not what this is about. It’s about our job to get the photos that the client expects us to get. And we are supposed to make these images exceed our clients expectations. But guests do not understand how they interfere with this when they think they are as important as the photographer that the bride and groom asked to take their photos. I’m talking about guests and client expectations. And a lot of photographers are struggling right now because new photographers are lowering the price bar. No industry wants to see this. And I think couples should know the difference between paying $500 and $5000. It’s not just about the photographers work.

Wow, it’s time for you to retire. blah, blah, blah, glory days…blah. It’s 2011 adjust or quit whining.

I think guests are as important as the photographer, if not more. I understand they are interfering with your job, but a lot of bigger weddings happen because brides and grooms want their friends and family there. They might think their guests having a good time is more important than photographs, even when photographs ARE a higher priority.

Also, by having photos that guests shoot, people have their own pictures. Maybe the composition will be off, and they won’t be art. But they will be readily available, without copyright restrictions for sharing, and truth be told….while I’ve seen lovely pro photographs, the group and guest shots they take as the go around the room are often unflattering and rushed at best…and the point and shoots do a fine job for that.

I agree with some of this, but I think it is a little extreme. Us “pros” need to roll with the times.

I sense frustration and I understand but I agree with anonymous to some extent. There is an air of superiority within the community and it is discouraging to those, like me, who would like to be like you. I also think that sometime some people want way too much and think their profession is worth more than it is given a certain climate and market. Houses, cars, etc. and yes, photography prices are inflated. Have respect for the $500 photographer and just maybe they’ll have a little respect for you.

I’m one of those cheap (i.e. free) amateur photographers that people ask to photograph their weddings. The expectation of the wedding couple is that they will get the great photos that the pro promised them. I can understand the photographer’s frustration, knowing that the wedding couple would have had many additional fantastic shots, had not wedding guests imposed their presence in order to “get the moment” themselves.

I’ve seen the photos most wedding guests make: important for their own memories, but lacking in most other aspects.

Thank you, Jason for voicing your opinion on this. It’s much too easy for “anonymous” posters to do what they do – hit and run and hide. This is an open forum. Got an opinion, voice it … but use your real name. As the publisher of this blog, I will exercise my right to pull incendiary remarks against the original poster. This isn’t some attempt to curb your “right” to speak openly or to “protect” the guest blogger, but to retain a sense of civility here. I want intelligent dialogue here, not diatribe. If you aren’t going to be civil with your remarks, you may return to your cave.

I think the key is to work with the guests and not against them. At every wedding I shoot, I set up the portraits and let the guests have first crack at the photos. During processionals, I set my lens wide open to blur out the paparazzi or tighten up the shot to crop them out. It doesn’t seem to be that big of a problem.

The Facebook situation is a different deal all together. It’s a travesty when a bride gets tagged in a guest photo, then posts it as her profile and goes on her honeymoon for two weeks. That’s where the pros have to step up their game. I take the same day slideshow that I make during the reception, and immediately watermark the shots and upload them to my facebook fan page and tag the bride and groom. And I do it the same night as the wedding. It takes about 15 minutes and it makes you look like a magician.

Finally, I think worrying about the $500 wedding photographer cutting into revenue is silly. The clients I’m going after appreciate good photography and are willing to pay for it. The cheap bride is also tends to be more difficult or critical. They are also less likely to get you referrals. Cheap begets cheap.

The goal is to go after the right clients, and set yourself apart from the amateurs. The guests are potential clients, not competition, and the only concern should be to document the day as the bride and groom remember it. Even if it means cloning out a few point and shoots.

Good article. But it’s annoying when I can’t get past the image of you photographing brides walking on small islands. The word is “aisles”, not “isles.

Great read, I’ve posted a link to it via my facebook page. I don’t shoot a lot of weddings on purpose, I find it stressful and in the end I think I make about $4/hr after all the time and editing, etc. (OK, maybe an exaggeration but I feel that way sometimes). At my last wedding I was standing in the middle of the room on a chair to try to shoot the couple through the crowd, while frantically trying to wave my assistant down to get her to move Uncle Bob out of my shot. I finally bent down and tapped the shoulder of a lady standing next to me and asked her to go ask him to move. There were so many cameras pointed at them from the crowd that at one point the bride actually said to the wedding party “look at Sherri, she’s the one I’m paying!”

Woah! I’ll be sure and change that asap! Thanks for bringing it to my attention.

A number of the churches I’ve been to don’t allow flash photography during the service. But as there has always been a guest who can’t or doesn’t know how to switch off their flash, the use of cameras were banned from the actual service, except for the professional. They have the skills and the right kit to not require flash… The image may not be what they regard as technically perfect, but it’s usually great and better than no images from the service.

I never get tired of this topic :-)

It is generally easier for people to complain than do something about it. I am a part-time wedding photographer, I charge about $3000 for the full day (without any printed products) and I have an unrelated full time “regular job” (which happens to be IT) which I have no intention on quitting. Why? Because times are different, life is expensive, and one really does not prevent me from doing the other. So I’ll do 10-20 weddings per season, nicely supplement by regular pay, and get a creative break from the daily grind. But I’m just one of many. This is a new breed wedding photographers and I’m sorry to tell you, they are here to stay, and this is why:

- Equipment is so accessible these days, there are very few obstacles to gaining entry to the market. There was a number of $8000 mentioned in the article for a starting kit, but this is just nonsense. You can get Canon 7D + 35mm f/1.4 + 85mm f/1.8 + 580EX flash for less than $4000 and you’re more than ready to hit the entry level (i.e. craigslist) market. Not to mention that you can RENT everything if you need to and for $150 you’ll have a great kit to shoot the wedding with.

- If you think about it, wedding photography is a perfect part-time gig. Shooting takes place on the weekends (when you’re off work) and you can work on the post processing in the evenings after work in the comfort of your home. You can answer emails throughout the day from your smart phone, and you can meet clients in coffee shops without having to blow rent money on a “studio” that sits empty most of the time anyway.

- Financially, it is extremely hard to turn it into a full-time business. So I have the option of say keeping my 60K day job and making another 30K doing a selected number of weddings during the summer, or I can break my back trying to earn 50K by doing it “full-time” (whatever that means anyway). To start making decent money you’ll probably have to take the route of big studios and start hiring contract photographers. You will most likely always be struggling as a single full-time guy unless you’re amazing (i.e. Sean Flanigan caliber). I know that hiring contractors is not “creatively satisfying” but don’t forget that it’s a business first, art second (as much as you hate that fact).

- By taking the part-time approach people have nothing to lose because they can never really go “out of business”. If year 1 is slow, that’s ok, they have their full time job to fall back on and work on the marketing/portfolio to prepare for year 2. Eventually, if they keep it up, they will become your worst enemy unless you’re better.

But I went off topic, I just wanted to make a few points related to the article:

1. Instead of blaming the $500 guy – get good. Actually scratch out good, become excellent. Look at trends, see what other cool kids are doing, don’t stick to the same old stuff and wonder why you can’t make a living. So let’s stop whining about not being able to sell $20 prints. Here is a reality check – everyone has access to professional labs these days, so charge for your time instead. And If you can’t become better than others, then do something else. I think the fact that photography became so accessible is a wonderful thing – it created a ton of competition, and as a result, improved the overall quality of the market. Those who were really great succeeded, those who weren’t had to pack up.

Besides, the $500 guy is not stealing your business. Those clients weren’t gonna pay 4K for the pictures anyway. The real challenge is to be sufficiently better than the $2500 guy so that people can justify spending $3500 on you.

2. If you find that you’re not making enough money despite everything, get a second job (or third) like everyone else.
3. Why do you care about guests posting pictures on facebook before you do? It simply DOESN’T MATTER. Do your own thing, be excellent at it, and no way is the guest with the Rebel going to make you look bad (if they do, then you shouldn’t be taking pictures)
4. Your job should be to tell the story (whatever that story may be). If that story happens to include a bunch of guests taking pictures, then so be it. It makes no sense to whine over the “good old times” when guests were more interesting subjects. How is that different than saying “I really wish this wedding was taking place somewhere else with bigger windows and nicer lighting and prettier bride so my portfolio can look awesome”? You are capturing THEIR day, and THEIR guests so to really be genuine, shoot it the way it is.

Just my 2 cents.

“If you think it’s expensive to hire a professional photographer for one day, the emotional cost of hiring an amateur lasts forever.” Absolutely. We made this mistake, and though our entire wedding was pretty low-budget, the amateur photographer is the one thing we regret about that. We tell EVERYONE now to be sure to get a good, professional photographer. Our photos were just terrible, and since the photographer was a friend of my husband’s dad, he sat down and ate during the reception instead of taking photos. We never even got the prints we asked for — just printed them ourselves, as he had given us digital proofs. But I guess we got what we paid for…

I agree that this is something that can be frustrating at weddings – the focusing beams in particular. But, honestly, what good does it do to complain about it, really? It’s not going to help or change anything.

The truth is, we’re not there to create moments – we’re there to capture them. People taking pictures of what’s happening IS what’s happening. If we’re getting paid $5000 to shoot a wedding, we should suck it up and work around it. If the camera & the armpit never go down – well, move and get her out of the shot. If cameras are all over the place – find a way to make them part of the photo, use them as your own off-camera flashes. If the whole crowd is looking at the back of the camera after she walks down the aisle – either make that a comical shot of what’s happening, or crop it out of your frame and don’t focus on the guests. We as photographers need to manage our expectations. It’s sad that in our current culture people don’t enjoy themselves at weddings as much as they photograph them. But that’s the reality. We can’t have a shot list in our heads of these emotional reactions we plan to get if they’re not there – or we have to be more patient and wait for them.